People aren't serious. We suck as a species, and if you would but THINK, and not shunt responsibility to your genes (genetic fallacy?) you would realise our spurious reasons for filling this floating slaughterhouse make it a moral imperative to NOT breed.
Who has kids for the benefit of the kid? Read ecclesiastes, what does all man's labor under the sun benefit him? Is it rational to speak of benefit to a bubble? A shadow? A reflection in a mirror, with as much persistence? The cost, the 'fatigues of the journey' is all that is certain. An 18th c suicide note reads, all this buttoning and unbuttoning. Truth. I'm depressed, but I still love reading, which my body interrupts with its maintenance chores. Further, since I don't want 'interventions' from beings as hopeless as myself, I have to keep up a basic social interactivity. I know that someone will suggest a vacation, or getting laid. Still more work. After all that maintenace bull(human)isht, why is existence, mere existence, so intolerable and in need of supplementation? And these things don't just fall into your lap, as it were.
Simply, no-one says life is all pain, but no-one says pain gives life meaning (except mealy mouth-ed buddhist like Calvin's dad and 'building character'....pick some peanuts out mah shhhhhiiiii@@@@t). However, Joy, which is just about all that gives life meaning, is both not guaranteed, and guaranteed to be fleeting. COntrast this to NOT being chained to the need/desire wheel.
I would like to call out Jon Ericson specifically ; "And I think that's as good an answer as exists. Whatever or whoever brought us into existence did so on its own terms and who are we to argue?" Others expressed similar sentiments but alluding more to the inertia of motion embedded in our genes, passing off chemical biases as philosophical insights. This I will mention merely to dismiss because most people smart enough to think in materialistic terms, soon grasp the philosophical lameplications of being digestive tracts that manage to replicate. Some of them even go on to read Peter Zappfer, who lived to be 90, but never had kids. Good thinking, Peter.
BUt the willfully irrational like JE get up my spleen. This mindless conformism to an agenda we cannot grasp, internalise or adopt as our own merely because we quake in uncomprehending awe is the worst sort of response to clear and present overbearing preponderance, such as GOd has over us. This nuremberg following of orders is the reason JE doesn't need a cerebrum, a brainstem would suffice, as Einstein said of the Nazis. Yes, I went Godwin on your ass, for two reasons:
i) holocaust aside, every Generation is a Genocide. We are all killed by death, picture a woman giving birth over a grave, and if this is repugnant, ask yourself if you are among the thousand men strikimg at the branches of evil, for every one striking the root. Not that I am blaming the Jews for birthing slaughtered offspring, but if they had peacefully died of old age like most wwii vets by now, it would still be as tragic and pointless, and if you stop sorting by cause the numbers become even more pertinent.
ii) Your postulate is Might makes Right therefore God WINS, even though he is an overbearing azzhoul who created us on a whim, because he can't sit quietly in a room by himself. And we know he's nuts because he looked at the world ,"and saw it was good'. REALLY? I hope I won't have to explain how 'original sin' is 'blaming the victim', a tithe-producing jedi mind trick.
It is immoral to reproduce. We owe god nothing, we owe the universe nothing, we owe our potential kids 30 seconds of rational, compassionate contemplation. we have no need to need, or cause needless needs in others. Our highest selves, the part that yearns for god, that wispy illusion of individuality, objective rationality, compassion, well it doesn't have much heft, but it has class. It has this: That it will not participate in this sordid waste of organic material. No obligation to take anyone or anything out of its/your misery, but to cold-bloodedly (or worse, senitmentally) consign someone else to this?? Gott verbot, Himmel Verbot!!!
Sorry to necro this post, but I think these concerns are valid as long as humanity is a going concern, also I was impressed by the lucidity you all demand of each other. WHich made it so hard to watch simple-minded red herrings form the axioms of what was so lucidly postulated.