1

Many philosophies and religions adopt either reincarnation (in cyclic creation) or resurrection (then final judgement then eternal life in paradise or hell).

Is there a philosophy or a religion which adopts both resurrection and reincarnation in the following format:

In the beginning of the cycle many generations of short life span (60-70-80 years) live on earth, then they die and their souls sleep until the resurrection and final judgement. After resurrection and judgement they live for their true life spans which are longer (600-700- 800 years, for example).

The new generations, coming after the resurrection, also have a long life span, like their fathers and forefathers. Then they all die (forefathers, fathers and new generations borne after resurrection) after living a long life span and their souls sleep, awaiting a new cycle of creation, and so on. As follows:

Soul reincarnated with shorter life span ,then died then resurrected with longer life span ,then new generations borne with long lifespan, then final death then new cycle,and so on.

Is there any philosophy or religion who adopt this view?

  • 1
    The Druze might have such beliefs - their religion has Islamic-Abrahamic origins, so presumably they believe in some form of final day of judgement or end times, yet at the same time they also believe in reincarnation. – Alexander S King Apr 5 '17 at 23:14
  • @AlexanderSKing ,I read about the Druze ,but I am asking also about changing life span from short life span to long life span. – salah Apr 5 '17 at 23:21
  • 1
    The Druze believe that you are reincarnated many times and eventually attain something similar to nirvana; they don't believe that you are reincarnated, judged, and then are reincarnated with longer life spans afterwards. My guess as to an answer to this is no, salah. There is no major school of philosophical thought that espouses this idea. Maybe a religion does, but that seems outside of the scope of this site. – Not_Here Apr 5 '17 at 23:22
  • @Not_Here ,reincarnated with shorter life span ,then died then resurrected with longer life span ,then final death then new cycle,and so on. – salah Apr 6 '17 at 13:46
  • A quick answer is: NO! – Salvatore Di Fazio Apr 6 '17 at 14:53
1

As I wrote quickly in a comment these two thought cannot be think together, this is one:

1. Resurection is the Christianity central focus. So what is Resurection:
   a. It is not reborn in a new human body
   b. It is not reborn in a new no-human body
   c. It is not go inside another body
   d. It is not a life that is not life (like zombies)

So what is Resurection? It is based on Jesus Resurection the only one that we know. He cannot die again (Rm 6,9), he looks like the same as before but he's body have we ability like walk throught the walls.

Some reference from the Gospel:

  1. Matthew: 28,2-10; 24,9-12
  2. Mark: 16,1-9; 20,2-10
  3. Luke: 24,1-8
  4. John: 20,1-29

Jesus Christ after his resurrection doesn't loss his body nor his memory. Indeed he recognise his disciples (have a look on the references above). Plus per St. Thomas Aquinas, Aristotle, St. Augustine Hippos the souls is immortal because that has own operations plus who have a start also have a goal and the reincarnation doesn't have any start or goal.

More specifically you can read the I answer that of the following questions:

Summa Theologiae, q. 75-81

For these philosophy reincarnation cannot exists because a human-kind is composed of one body and one soul

  • like eastern teachments the soul/essence is eternal ,never created,never die .Like the Druze the soul should have a body .The point is :the soul losses memory/the soul doesn't loss the memory.If the soul lost memory after dying then the next step is reincarnation .If the soul doesn't loss the memory after dying then the next step is Resurrection . – salah Apr 8 '17 at 15:01
  • @salah indeed if you read what I wrote and the references I gave you can understand that the soul does NOT loss memory... Let me edit my answer and wrote it specifically – Salvatore Di Fazio Apr 9 '17 at 4:40
  • You didn't get what I am saying ,I say : after death ,if the memory is lost then the next step is reincarnation .if the memory still present then the next step is resurrection .both reincarnation and resurrection can co-exist.living forever in paradise or hell is implausible/unaccepted because of the problem of boredom . – salah Apr 9 '17 at 14:17
  • Body is inert .what feels is the soul ,what thinks is the soul,what eats ,drinks,gets sad,gets happy ,is the soul .Body is just an inert coat . – salah Apr 9 '17 at 14:27
  • sorry @salah but I do understand what you saying but you don't :) ... reincarnation and resurrection cannot work together because the person is one body plus his one soul – Salvatore Di Fazio Apr 9 '17 at 16:36
1

No, because resurrectionists and reincarnationists assume diametrically opposed anthropologies.

St. Thomas Aquinas teaches that a human is an inextricable composite of a body and soul; the human soul begins to exist when the body does.

This is different from the view of the reincarnationist Platonists, who think human souls exist before the body and that man is a “soul clothed with a body.”

St. Thomas Aquinas, in Summa Contra Gentiles II cap. 83, gives some philosophical reasons against reincarnation.

(cf. this answer to "How are the soul and the body 'related' to each other according to the RCC?")

0

So far as I know, there is no major theology that combines these two distinct concepts, which, strictly speaking, are mutually exclusive in that they represent two distinct forms of maintenance of the immortal soul.

In the west you see a mythology of revenants (which is to say corporeal regeneration in the same body) going back potentially to Mesopotamia, and certainly in Egypt and Europe. (Freyja had the power to bring back the dead, and the Mabonogion has a very famous example of a cauldron with similar power. In Egypt, you have figures such as Osiris, albeit a god, but physically resurrected, like Zagreus/Dionysus, and some scholars link this to the subsequent resurrection in Christian lore.)

By contrast, Eastern mythology is filled with avatars in both Indian and Chinese mythology. (This is widely understood in regard to Indian philosophies, but the 108 Stars of Destiny is one of many examples from Chinese folklore.)

I suspect the reason you don't see these concepts merged is that physical regeneration of the dead is fundamentally incompatible with transmigration of the soul in the sense that, you either regenerate the original vessel, or the soul shifts to a new vessel. (Sort of a "choose one or the other" situation;)


That said, there is a line from Pindar that may suggest the concept of reincarnation was present in Ancient Greece (for although a god was resurrected, it was not something available to humans, whose souls either went to Hades or, later, the Elysian Fields):

Those who have persevered three times, on either side, to keep their souls free from all wrongdoing, follow Zeus' road to the end, to the tower of Cronus, where ocean breezes blow around the island of the blessed, and flowers of gold are blazing, some from splendid trees on land, while water nurtures others.
Source: Perseus

I was certainly taught that souls in Elysium could be reincarnated, but would need to look into this more deeply.

  • Just feel I need to comment that Plato used mythology to talk about Philosophy, and he was considered to be rather important. – DukeZhou Apr 6 '17 at 20:59
0

I feel that the discussion is stuck in the wrong set of terms and concepts, and I know of no religion or philosophy that meets the OP's specification.

Rebirth of some kind is almost always asserted by religion since without it an evolutionary view of consciousness becomes impossible as does any sensible system of ethics. The subtler idea is of an ocean of consciousness from which individual 'alters' arise like waves, not separate but identifiable as a disturbance.

Thus our consciousness would arise from the ocean and when it falls back it carries with it impressions or tendencies, and these will lead to a further incarnation of consciousness since it has yet to be fully purified of ego-desires and so forth.

This is the merry-go-round that Buddhists, Taoists, Sufis, Theosophists, Advaitans and their like are trying to get off for the sake of union with 'God' or 'nirvana' and eternal peace.

The common 'Christian' idea that our final reward will be to be resurrected in our human bodies is a non-starter. It is not taught by Jesus and it is not a goal pursued by any seeker with ambition. A body is a limit and not compatible with true freedom and immortality. Even if we were resurrected in this way we would still not have achieved our potential.

As for the numbers game, this is irrelevant once we think of consciousness as unified. For the mystic consciousness is All and it is ONE. It would be only our conceptual delusions that lead us to think otherwise.

I suggest leaving modern Christianity aside and having a look at the classical form of it, and also checking out 'rebirth' in Buddhism. You'll have objections but they probably won't be the same ones. It may also be worth reading Schrodinger's argument against the multiplicity of souls, an idea he rejects outright in favour of the Upanishadic view of consciousness, rebirth and God. This would the view taken by the Perennial philosophy in general and it is not easy to find telling objections to it. Indeed, it has proved impossible to date.

It is worth saying that even quite skilled Buddhists struggle with the details of rebirth. Also it can be noted that while Buddhist doctrine can be justified and proved in logic for the most part, the doctrine of karma and rebirth is, as far as I can tell, a 'lemma' in the sense that while it is logically coherent and consistent with the rest of the doctrine it cannot actually be proved in logic. That is, the ontology, epistemology and cosmology can be justified by metaphysical analysis, but not karma and rebirth. They would follow naturally but we are not forced to endorse them.

All in all it's a very difficult topic and only accessible to a serious student of comparative religion or hands-on yoga practice.

  • You is just a new-Platonism idea that Plotinus described. For Agustin Hippos and Thomas Aquinas resurrection is what is more logical in this life. Or those are not philosopher because Christians ? – Salvatore Di Fazio Apr 11 '17 at 9:56
  • Yep. I share the view of Plotinus. It is the 'perennial' view so it is found all over. – PeterJ Oct 14 '17 at 10:44

Your Answer

By clicking “Post Your Answer”, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.