It seems that we can say that we are completely governed by the universe but then at the same time step into a state of freedom to choose and have the power of will. How is it possible that both states can be our reality depending on our state of thinking?

  • Let us continue this discussion in chat. Mar 9 '18 at 18:22
  • There are two modes of "objectivity". Etic or "physical scientific" one is a look from god's or other planet alien's observing position. The other, emic "objectivity" is human consiousness' look in objectivistic perspective, that is, in terms of facts and states (rater than of intentions and options). Now, fate is a concept from emic, not etic, objectivity. Freedom or will are also emic terms. Emic (humanitarian) and etic (scientific) domains cannot and should not be mixed or merged. Your Q body seems to me like mixing them together; if it is so no answer can just be conceived.
    – ttnphns
    Mar 25 '18 at 6:32

In a classical universe, it may be possible in principle to predict things, but impossible in practice. So we use predictors like character and identity instead of just initial conditions.

In a quantum universe, there is https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superdeterminism

So, in these views free will is the subjective experience, even in a deterministic system.

Fate is usually used in a different sense though, in terms of inner qualities or characteristics which must inevitably manifest, in a way that can't be subverted by rational choice or other subset of who someone is, that results from their whole being. Perhaps that they were born with, or was otherwise predetermined. So I suggest you can have choice, determinism, and fate, all separately.

Always seemed to me determinism is borne out of cognitive bias, rather than any specific observations though. If you can't solve the problem of induction, how can determinism even be meaningful? It would be beyond any possible science to observe it as logically required or inevitable, or even as set to continue. Quantum mechanics has further shown god does play dice, and not just with the future, with the past.


That depends on how one defines "the universe". Assuming you include yourself as part of the Universe and the Universe also include everything that exists, then any free will you have is "completely governed by the universe".

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